what to do if a man has been used for sex by your HR manager and then fired

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what to do if a man has been used for sex by your HR manager and then fired

Posted by: lonnie
Date: 12/22/2006 11:19:00 AM

I am a GSM with a auto dealership in auburn washington..after only working at my new job for two weeks my HR manager invited me up to "HER" house for a meeting (she is also the one of the owners) iwas greeted with a drink "vodka" and she started talking about business and within a few drinks she started talking about sex and desires(the clothes came off and we had sex ...these meetings became regular but ended as quick as it started when my wife called her to ask why she was talking to me so much on my cell...two weeks later i am out of a JOB what should i do?

Reply from:	emarie
Date:	12/26/2006 1:37:00 PM
Reply:	It sounds like this woman is predatory. But a good rule of thumb for business meetings is don't drink or drink ONLY one. When she talked about sex, you should have said "That's a very healthy attitude. My wife says the same thing," and kept it all business or at least kept putting your wife, verbally, between you. I am not blaming you. You were used, but the clothes didn't just "come off." You had choices. All the calls weren't about business. It's awful to be targeted, but the second the conversation from business, especially in her HOME, with ALCOHOL there, you needed to excuse yourself. Did you try to say no? Say how this felt uncomfortable and risked your career? Did you confide in your wife that your boss doing this? Did you go to others about this? Again, it's not your fault. You were a victim, but not entirely unwilling. Would she have fired you if you said no? I'm sorry this happened, but women deal with this all the time. We lose no matter what. If we say no, we are punished. If we cave to pressure we are "sleeping our way to the top". Consider this a lesson learned, work on your marriage, keep your wife in the loop and be assertive about professionalism. "No, I only do business meetings either at work or with the entire department, and I'm sure you, as an HR director, understand why, in this litigious climate, I would need to protect your reputation and mine by setting those limits." Or, "No, I don't drink alcohol at business functions because it dulls my mind and I like to give my job my best." You could file a complaint with your state department of labor. It puts her behaviour on record. Write to her colleagues explaining the situation, cc'ing them on the cell bill, that they should be aware they could be sued. They may not know anything about her little business meetings at her home. Then move on, learn from this, and beg your wife's forgiveness. You may have been victimized, but so was she and she had no chance to decide to end this.

Reply from:	lonnie
Date:	12/27/2006 3:40:00 PM
Reply:	Thanks for the response ...im with out a job and i feel that its all my fault for not saying "NO" but i do recall saying it was not right and getting the response "Who's going to know" well my wife has filled for divorce and im without a job ...My HR Manager is still working there and happy as a lark...I just know if it were the other way around some one would be sued...

Reply from:	emarie
Date:	12/27/2006 8:14:00 PM
Reply:	I'm sorry. I know you wish you had said no, but she had power over you, AND used of alcohol to diminish your inhibitions. She's amoral. Contact your state labor department. You should really examine why you were susceptible to this, what was going on in your marriage that you let it continue, and then ask your wife out for coffee and beg her forgiveness. Tell her you were an idiot and tell her the things you learned about yourself that made you act like an idiot (don't blame her in the slightest or even the Woman, since your wife will NOT want to hear that...if your wife bears some responsibility for marital problems, THAT can be come out in therapy, but FIRST you must own this). Ask her to go to a counselor with you. Promise to tell her if ever you get this vibe from a woman again, give her your email passwords, cell password and anything if she wants to be able to check up on you any time of day. She has every right to be furious and suspicious, but you want to build a new career and a better life with her. Promise to do what she asks to make her feel safe and comfortable. Don't just SAY you are sorry; SHOW her. Ask HER what she needs to consider reconciling. Hold your head up and job hunt. Contact that tramp and tell her if she says a negative word to anyone about why you chose to leave (say it that way...never say you were fired...ever!) you will not only sue but tell everyone what she did. When employers ask why you left the job, be honest: say you did not believe the work environment was honest and ethical. Don't elaborate. YOU chose to leave; and tell them you will NOT get a good reference because they know how you felt. Offer character and other work references (including a pastor who might know the truth and could support what you said without details). Lonnie, if it were the other way someone MAY be sued, but take it from me, we women do NOT often win, despite the laws. Don't scapegoat women or presume we have it easy. We don't.

Reply from:	emarie
Date:	12/27/2006 9:13:00 PM
Reply:	Lonnie: One last thing. Maybe if you let your wife read this series of exchanges, as a last ditch effort if she refuses counseling, she may reconsider. I would NOT start with this, but you could at least say you sought advice on line about how badly your boss AND YOU screwed up your life and are now seeing the role you played in it, and are taking responsibility. That you are heartysick about losing her and depressed about how your career self-destructed. That while you made a terrible choice that hurt her and violated your marriage, at least one person at this site does believe you were taken advantage of. I don't let you totally off the hook: you had a choice and the series of phone calls are hard to ignore, but I DO think that woman used you and you were in a bad spot, and are now capable of learning from this, examining WHY you let it happen even though you were NOT looking for anything like that and never had before (I hope to God I am right about this because if this has happened before, you are so screwed!). Tell her you failed her and beg her to start counseling with you before proceeding with the divorce. You should not lose everything. In the meantime, get out there and get a job to show her you have started over again and hope she will be willing to with you. Good luck.

Reply from:	lonnie
Date:	12/28/2006 11:24:00 AM
Reply:	well thanks again for your coments...she (my wife has a new boyfriend already) so i guess thats out of the question...now i am just mad about the hole thing and i have that get even feeling ...Did I also mention that the HR manager is one of the owners of the company...

Reply from:	emarie
Date:	12/28/2006 7:32:00 PM
Reply:	Yeah, you did mention that, Lonnie, which makes what she did all the worse. It is such an abuse of power. But you can still learn from it. Why WERE you so susceptible? Why was your wife so ready to move on so fast to a new man? There must have been some problems underneath. Be careful about the "get even" feeling, Lonnie. That is very corrosive to your well being. But I don't think it is a bad idea to contact your state labor relations board or whatever office oversees labor disputes and set this story out before them. In fact, I think if you can do so calmly and dispassionately, they will follow up. You may be entitled to some compensation (eg. if your are out of work because of emotional trauma worker's comp may be in order). I recommend for your own healing that you sit down and write a letter of apology to your wife, not begging her to come back but admitting what you did was wrong, and she deserved better. that you miss her and wish she could forgive you but don't blame her if she can't. Tell you will never do anything like this to another woman again, that you are dedicating your life to honesty and integrity, and that will try to live honorably to make amends for the harm you did. Lonnie, that HR woman was wrong, but now you know what women deal with. It hurts a lot, eh? You might still consider a cc'd letter with photocopies of the phone bill to her fellow owners explaining the "private meeting" ...you never did say what excuse they gave for firing you, but I bet it's pretty specious...point that out. Tell them to ask other men who have worked closely with her. Tell them your wife called her. Tell them they HR woman ruined your marriage. Don't make threats. Just say it. (Check with the attorney here to be sure you are safe from libel. He calls himself goodboss...hmmm) You can rise above this and prevail.

Reply from:	goodboss
Date:	12/31/2006 6:30:00 PM
Reply:	1. I don't think you have any kind of a case for sexual harassment as your affair appears to be entirely consensual. You don't seem to have done anything at all whatsoever to discourage the affair, or object to it in any way. If you did, please elaborate. 2. What was the reason your ex-employer gave for letting you go? All you said was that your wife called your lover and two weeks later your job disappeared. What exactly happened? 3. Are you in Canada or the US? If in Canada, how long did you work for this company, what was your position title, and how old are you? Your responses will guide my advice (if any) to you.

Reply from:	emarie
Date:	1/22/2007 1:27:00 AM
Reply:	I think what people need to do in these situations is consider the profit/loss ratio. Lawsuits are tough. But one thing Lonnie, that you have in your favor is that many courts will view her actions as coercive, as subtly threatening (you want to keep your job come to my house for a meeting). There is a massive power differential between the two of you which many judges and juries would see as cause for you winning a harrasment suit. Even the outward appearence of consensual relations can be demonstrated to be something you continued to engage in because she made it plain she expected it and you fell into it and were naive. Even if you enjoyed it, you did not seek it out and you were never in a safe position to just say no. It is possible some courts would see ths as a classic quid pro quo harassment case. Lonnnie, I'm sure you already know the ways in which you blew it in this case, and the repercussions in your personal life have been devastating (which actually improves the viability of your cause of action...damages of both a quantitative AND qualitative nature). I can't advise you either way legally because I don't have the credentials and won't pretend to. I can say that it is worth discussing, maybe with a legal aid attorney first to see if you have a case. (see continued)

Reply from:	emarie
Date:	1/22/2007 1:28:00 AM
Reply:	(continued) Juries are going to be hard on you, my friend. As a wife I recoiled at what happened, from your wife's point of view. But then I realized that if I'd reversed sexes, it would clearly be a case of coersion and pressure to keep your job. Men are sexually harassed all the time, albeit not as often as women, but it is an underreported crime, just like male rape, because guys worry a jury wouldn't believe them, but it happens enough for me to take your case very seriously. If you were afraid you'd lose your job if you stopped and then, lo and behold, soon after your wife called The Woman (and I'm afraid there were a lot of us cheering out here for THAT show of smarts! Your wife stood up to her...I'm just sorry for your sake it was on her way out the door) you lost your job, regardless of the excuse you may have a cause of action, especially because of the power differential. Teachers can't boink their students; psychologists can't have sex with clients, presidents and congressmen can't go after interns (oops!)...I'm sorry this happened to you, Lonnie. Please keep me informed.

Reply from:	goodboss
Date:	1/22/2007 4:41:00 PM
Reply:	"Teachers can't boink their students; psychologists can't have sex with clients, presidents and congressmen can't go after interns..." - not necessarily ethical or moral, but if it's consensual, it's perfectly legal!

Reply from:	emarie
Date:	1/27/2007 10:32:00 PM
Reply:	Poor little obsessed boy! Consult an attorney on this one. You are, as usual, wrong again. And, again, goodatbossing, as I said before, I am SO outta this site, so you can keep your puny, ill-informed opinions to yourself. There is no such thing as consent when there is a power differential like this. Anyone in Human Resources and Affirmative action knows this. Lonnie, I have felt a real closeness to you. I think because I, too, am a deeply flawed person, and was once in a quid pro quo coersive "relationship" with the same unequal power differential. He was fired so he would not have to face a lawsuit for pressing a student into an unwanted situation. I was young but not so young that I didn't know what was going on. And I was confused and VERY afraid. My career depended upon this man and thankfully I confided in a female professor who took over the fight for me. Lonnie, I hope you are able to find good work. If your wife truly has moved on for good, I am sorry you are paying that price, since I DO see you as having been victimized (and I really didn't fully appreciate how much until I reversed the genders in my mind...people think if I GUY is getting it from his boss, way to go, but they are more willing to see women as vulnerable). Well I think you got hosed. Please stay safe. Find good work, friends and a good relationship in your life and know that people have bounced back from worse and you will, too. Goodbye my friend. I have to go or risk bein harassed at every thread at which I make a point that Smarty Pants doesn't agree with. Crimney, he must've been easy to toilet train...he's awfully anal retentive, don't you think? Adios, amigo, Lonnie.

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